[Feedback] Giga-Nerf Energy Shield in Patch 0.4.0

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Sakanabi#6664 schrieb:

No, that's called stupidity. Balance is about bringing all defenses to make them feel good.

No more buffs to defenses as that will strip most challenge from the game, thats why its better to nerf ES as it's clearly overtuned.

Yes, that's called intelligent.

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CharlesJT#7681 schrieb:

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Sakanabi#6664 schrieb:

No, that's called stupidity. Balance is about bringing all defenses to make them feel good.

No more buffs to defenses as that will strip most challenge from the game, thats why its better to nerf ES as it's clearly overtuned.

Yes, that's called intelligent.

I think you might not have understood what game you were playing, because the only challenge the game presents is the one you choose to create for yourself. Especially for the endgame.

If you want the game to be easy, it will be. If you want it to be difficult, it will be difficult too, because ultimately everything depends on your choices and the freedom you have to make them. The skill tree and equipment allow you to build the adventure and the gameplay experience you want.

Fundamentally, I don't see how the freedom of others would infringe upon your freedom to make your own choices. You are free to play as you wish, just as others are.

If you ultimately believe that energy shields are too strong, that's your prerogative, and if you believe it should be nerfed, that's your prerogative too.

But the suggestion to arbitrarily nerf something that works doesn't make much sense. Especially since this defensive layer functions as intended and is well-suited to the classes it was designed for.

If the idea that others might approach the game differently than you is unbearable to you, then I don't think the problem is that the energy shield is too strong. :) It's more that you should play a Soulslike and not an ARPG.

The core issue remains the game's balance, and I hope it will be addressed soon, as it will allow the different character classes and ascendencies, as well as the offensive and defensive layers, to be effective and offer everyone a more coherent gameplay experience than what currently exists.

Nerfing everything means depriving ourselves of possibilities and impoverishing the game. The most striking example was League 0.2.0 and its well-known success.

hard disagree, i think other forms of defense should be brought up to the level of ES. being one shot isn't challenging, it's dumb.
there are plenty of games more challenging than PoE2 (what with the recent popularity of soulslikes and otherwise "difficult action RPG") that don't rely on cheeky one shots for their difficulty.
random one shots actually made my build feel non functional, while i cruised through the campaign and early end game the T15 juiced deliriums prove to make my build useless as the skill i use locks me in place for 0.5s and that's enough for me to get straight up deleted from range even though i invested in lots of defense on the passive skill tree and feel like i've got adequate gear/resistances.
would like to change builds but can't respec ascendancy because trials so i guess i'm out. i realize you (OP) probably don't care but my input isn't necessarily targeted at players, i'm sure the devs do care that people are turned away from the game because they're getting in such bad positions for no fault of their own really.

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Hexmxm#0804 schrieb:

Fundamentally, I don't see how the freedom of others would infringe upon your freedom to make your own choices. You are free to play as you wish, just as others are.

You are assuming he's asking for these egregious nerfs in good faith. All I see here, is a constant bump of his threads that are basically advocating for the total ruination of this game.

Just look at the title, the proof is right there, "Giga-Nerf". It's 100% rage baiting. He has a similar thread with the same troll structure in his title but for +Skills.

Energy shield is perfectly fine where it's currently at. The amount of 1 shot mechanics this game has is quite out there. Asking for energy shield nerf is asking for more 1 shot. The thruth is that defenses in this game are not good because the game is designed in a way you have to nuke the screen fast and same for boss killing.

The most successful build don't rely on defenses, they kill uber boss in seconds before their animations can occur, but somehow, to him, the thing that needs to be adressed is energy shield because "it's too good".

I know my post only bumps his thread, and he will use it as an opportunity to bump it later but I would like to simply point out that this thread was not written in good faith and that the ultimate goal here is to ruin the game.

I swear on my life, honor, and everything I love that If GGG were to implement literally what OP is asking for, that I believe this game would be ruined beyond repair and that GGG reputation would be forever shit stained.

0.2 was a warning. If they do this kind of idiocratic change by listening to rogue player base that seek this game ruination, then this game is done for.

CharlesJT is right, balancing defences and removing + levels on non-unique items will both make POE 2 a better game.

And the measurement which is to be used for a better game = more players.

On HC SSF (btw) there are 12 players at level 100 now. 10 of them rely on ES.

On HC, there are 22 players at level 100 now, 21 of them rely on ES.

You can check the rest at poe ninja, but clearly the above numbers are not balanced.


As for the + levels, all of the above characters have them pretty much on all possible items.

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Legioona#1076 schrieb:

CharlesJT is right, balancing defences and removing + levels on non-unique items will both make POE 2 a better game.

And the measurement which is to be used for a better game = more players.

On HC SSF (btw) there are 12 players at level 100 now. 10 of them rely on ES.

On HC, there are 22 players at level 100 now, 21 of them rely on ES.

You can check the rest at poe ninja, but clearly the above numbers are not balanced.


As for the + levels, all of the above characters have them pretty much on all possible items.

Since patch 0.3.0, armor archetypes have received an elemental reduction modifier that operates before the reduction applied by resistance stats.

In practice, armor can be just as strong as energy shields.

Virtually, armor (physical reductions) + body chest pieces (elemental reduction modifiers) + resistance caps + life recoup + life regen => Brings builds to an immortal state.

Why are energy shields more popular? Simply because they're easier to use, as they cover the entire range of damage, not because they're overpowered.

Armor builds are more challenging because they require multiple layers of defense (physical armor + elemental reduction on the chest + cap resistance + regeneration + health regeneration) for a result equivalent to energy shields at high levels.

Therefore, CharlesJT is completely wrong in that he's calling for a nerf to something that works, based on something he doesn't understand in terms of mechanics, something that received a significant buff in 0.3.0 and is called armor. Clearly, he's missed the point regarding physical and elemental damages reduction and the techniques for recouping from damages.

Arguing that the game needs to be challenging when it already is, except that he doesn't perceive the depth of the mechanics the game offers in terms of defensive layering.

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And the measurement which is to be used for a better game = more players.

Well, the game launched with over half a million players, and each league launch attracts 240,000 to 300,000 players. Frankly, I have more faith in GGG's game directors than in CharlesJT's nerfed vision.

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Oinkaments#6390 schrieb:

I know my post only bumped his thread, and he'll use it as an opportunity to bump it later, but I'd simply like to point out that this thread wasn't written in good faith and that the ultimate goal here is to ruin the game.

I'm aware of that :) However, it allowed others to make well-reasoned and good-faith suggestions and share their experiences with the game. In itself, that's a good thing.

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Oinkaments#6390 schrieb:

The thruth is that defenses in this game are not good because the game is designed in a way you have to nuke the screen fast and same for boss killing.

This statement tells me you have blaster mentality, which is cancer for arpg's. Running around and nuking entire screens at once is not good game design, but an "I Win Button."

I'm proposing a Giga-Nerf to ES to move PoE2 closer to Diablo 2. Slow the game down and make monsters a real challenge. Buffing the other defenses only makes the game easier, which is the wrong direction. Nerfing ES is justified and the best path forward for the overall health of PoE2 and only wish success for GGG.

This thread is done in a good faith effort and your constant remarks saying I want this game ruined tells me you're the one failing the good faith test. I think you simply don't understand what makes a good arpg... blaster mentality is proof of that.

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Oinkaments#6390 schrieb:

Spoiler

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Hexmxm#0804 schrieb:

Fundamentally, I don't see how the freedom of others would infringe upon your freedom to make your own choices. You are free to play as you wish, just as others are.

You are assuming he's asking for these egregious nerfs in good faith. All I see here, is a constant bump of his threads that are basically advocating for the total ruination of this game.

Just look at the title, the proof is right there, "Giga-Nerf". It's 100% rage baiting. He has a similar thread with the same troll structure in his title but for +Skills.

Energy shield is perfectly fine where it's currently at. The amount of 1 shot mechanics this game has is quite out there. Asking for energy shield nerf is asking for more 1 shot. The thruth is that defenses in this game are not good because the game is designed in a way you have to nuke the screen fast and same for boss killing.

The most successful build don't rely on defenses, they kill uber boss in seconds before their animations can occur, but somehow, to him, the thing that needs to be adressed is energy shield because "it's too good".

I know my post only bumps his thread, and he will use it as an opportunity to bump it later but I would like to simply point out that this thread was not written in good faith and that the ultimate goal here is to ruin the game.

I swear on my life, honor, and everything I love that If GGG were to implement literally what OP is asking for, that I believe this game would be ruined beyond repair and that GGG reputation would be forever shit stained.

0.2 was a warning. If they do this kind of idiocratic change by listening to rogue player base that seek this game ruination, then this game is done for.

Glad i'm not the only one with this kind of thoughts about his threads, slightly different i dont think he wants to to ruin the game, all of his threads are all in search of community approval rather than giving well thought feedbacks.
Nerf tailwind, nerf ES, free respecs and stuff and when his thread doesnt get replies he bump it with "Nobody else think blablabla?"
Nerfing ES wont stop 1 shotting blast everything and nerf to tailwind wont make other builds faster.
I really struggle to find a valid point on all of his thread, the only one that make sense to me is the community approval.