What happened to Engaging Combat? Video Feedback.

I skipped 24 pages so tl;dr. I’ve written dozens of posts about how PoE 2 and GGG have a serious identity problem. They want to make Dark Souls, but instead you get a hundred braindead mobs running at you, cornering you, and chain light-stunning you. They nerf movement speed and offer you these monstrous tunnel-like layouts where all you do is run from one dead end to another.

People aren’t creating broken zoom-zoom builds just because the game is “broken” and GGG missed it — most of the time, it’s literally the only way to play. I’m still waiting to see how Jonathan plans to “skillfully parry” 100 breach mobs under delirium on a juiced T16 maps.


And deadeye just so popular because influence, 99% of deadeye players never thought about MS, they just copypasting fungbun build.

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IonSugeRau1#1069 schrieb:

Have any video on that? I don't remember D3 having engaging combat.

The funny thing that D3 actually was really cool and engaging at the very start and teasers. Check some old D3 videos or D3 teasers from development, they were great and resambled PoE2 teasers in some way.
Then after release and giga hate of RMT auction / several difficulties etc. the game rapidly went to the tremendous powercreep making bosses absolete, and when the RoS released the game was mostly "skippable" to the REAL GAME (rifts) showering legendaries and zooming around. Campaign become absolete with all the story and bosses who can't even say their vaicelines etc.
So the D3 was killed by the same as GGG just did in 0.3 (not completely yet and the hope is still alive).
You can check some old D3 videos by searching for inferno difficulty. It was removed pretty soon when the game become zoomer clicker.

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Nikuksis#6962 schrieb:

The funny thing that D3 actually was really cool and engaging at the very start and teasers. Check some old D3 videos or D3 teasers from development, they were great and resambled PoE2 teasers in some way.
Then after release and giga hate of RMT auction / several difficulties etc. the game rapidly went to the tremendous powercreep making bosses absolete, and when the RoS released the game was mostly "skippable" to the REAL GAME (rifts) showering legendaries and zooming around. Campaign become absolete with all the story and bosses who can't even say their vaicelines etc.
So the D3 was killed by the same as GGG just did in 0.3 (not completely yet and the hope is still alive).

Actually....D3 gameplay videos from prior to release were of a completely "different" game. The things shown, such as being able to climb bosses, or party play, and other mechanics, were NEVER in the released version of the game....power creep or otherwise. It didn't really have anything to do with the RMAH, they simply only released videos of a game that no longer existed.

But yes...then everything went very quickly off the rails from there.

I'll see if I can find the old Siegebreaker video that was used to advertise D3 gameplay that.....did not exist in D3.

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Nikuksis#6962 schrieb:

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IonSugeRau1#1069 schrieb:

Have any video on that? I don't remember D3 having engaging combat.

The funny thing that D3 actually was really cool and engaging at the very start and teasers. Check some old D3 videos or D3 teasers from development, they were great and resambled PoE2 teasers in some way.
Then after release and giga hate of RMT auction / several difficulties etc. the game rapidly went to the tremendous powercreep making bosses absolete, and when the RoS released the game was mostly "skippable" to the REAL GAME (rifts) showering legendaries and zooming around. Campaign become absolete with all the story and bosses who can't even say their vaicelines etc.
So the D3 was killed by the same as GGG just did in 0.3 (not completely yet and the hope is still alive).

i played d3 on day one and barb was broken on day1 to the point of being immortal. some wizard class could perma freeze bosses... and some hand-xbow class would have clear speed matching poe1 nado shot... i think all that 'combat' stayed in the teasers.

Here's the gameplay video that Blizzard released. Almost none of which made it into even the beta version of the game.

https://www.google.com/search?q=d3+gameplay+sample+video+pre-release&client=firefox-b-1-d&sca_esv=bcf121094a44e43b&sxsrf=AE3TifPs4EDwiRKpE7RkAXUOspsApDAZyA%3A1758408435751&ei=8y7PaMzQLbSv5NoPr4XqyQ8&ved=0ahUKEwiMlrvxteiPAxW0F1kFHa-COvkQ4dUDCBI&uact=5&oq=d3+gameplay+sample+video+pre-release&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiJGQzIGdhbWVwbGF5IHNhbXBsZSB2aWRlbyBwcmUtcmVsZWFzZTIFECEYoAEyBRAhGKABSKgYUI4DWLsXcAF4AZABAJgBwAGgAYMTqgEEMC4xNrgBA8gBAPgBAZgCEaACwxTCAgoQABiwAxjWBBhHwgIFECEYqwLCAgUQIRifBZgDAIgGAZAGA5IHBjEuMTUuMaAHqkWyBwYwLjE1LjG4B64UwgcFMi05LjjIB4oB&sclient=gws-wiz-serp#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:c4954e0f,vid:Q17FDfU7-ds,st:0

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KäsePizza#3007 schrieb:

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yes.....and I already explained every single one of these points.

The reason why PoE 2 CAN'T be its own game....is because it was developed as a copy/paste of PoE 1. I don't WANT it to be PoE1....but that is simply what it was built to be.

It is the product we have in our hands: a PoE 1 clone. All your comments boil down to "well they made it separate because they didn't want xyz"..........but they didn't built it correctly. It spent too much time in development as an expansion. It shows. The games are identical in basically every aspect except speed and power.

I've asked numerous times for someone to point to me one single MEANINGFUL difference between PoE 1 and PoE 2, besides the fact that it is just generally slower. And even that one point is only temporary, as we all are aware in this thread.

Every system is the SAME as PoE 1. That makes it foundationally the same game.


That is the permanent mistake of PoE 2: it ISN'T a different or separate game. At least not in terms of function or foundation.

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draco359#5475 schrieb:

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AverBeg7#1689 schrieb:

Ok, but what specifically is doing this? It's just not my experience, I'm not familiar with builds that do that.

No one will name those builds because they don't want GGG to nerf them...which makes the player base hypocrites by saying tey want less power and more hassle, but not having the balls to name the troublesome builds.

I am fine with the difficulty of this game and won't bother naming such builds.

What are you talking about my guy. Everyone names the strong things they find. How do you think PoE creators exist? And this guy, has a problem with being too strong in A3 but can't specifically say how or when or what???? Did he not play to see this problem??????

It seems like everyone that "wants the game to be a certain pace" can't even point to something too fast that makes sense to be upset about, or something that denotes the pace that they desire.

They are all wholly unspecific and talking about wanting completely different things from each other, but somehow united in complaining to and disagreeing with anyone that does not share the same sentiment.

To begin with, the sentiment you are expressing has no form, it is not a thing, you need to actually express what you want specifically in what stages of the game, or it makes 0 sense.

When you agree with each other, it is not about a specific part of the game. It is just this formless idea. The fact the idea has no form and you have no vision for what you actually want means you don't know what you are agreeing to.

As someone that actually plays the juiced content but enjoys the pacing of the earlier parts of the game, there is not a specific change I can point to in this thread and go "that kinda makes sense". It is all formless idealism with no real forward thinking.

You guys refuse to accept that ARPG is a genre where things get increasingly more ridiculous on screen no matter what baseline you begin with, when it just is by nature. It exists in every ARPG (whereas your ideal does not), it is the first and biggest hurdle to overcome when talking about the pacing and integrity of combat as the game progresses.

The fact you refuse to acknowledge it exists and have no answer to fix or mitigate it, while at the same time being unable to articulate another vision that could take it's place, just automatically makes your solutions unviable because they run into exactly the same problem. The game you propose would just have the same problems, starting from a different baseline.

Basically you are saying "Hey, GGG, you know how you made an enitrely new game to fix some problems and introduce new ideas? Wanna do that again and hope it's better this time?"

If you are outlining the issues that are affecting you in-game, to your character, specifically in a playthrough you did then it is really easy to understand what you mean. When it is just you expressing a feeling you get from struggling a little bit then watching other people blast with further progressed characters, it is just this sour intent to gimp everyone that does nothing but poison the well.

It is completely valid to say "At this part of the game, playing this build on this class, I felt my progression broke and I started enjoying myself less"

It is NOT valid to say "I feel like combat is not engaging, everyone just zooms". At what point did YOU feel like combat was not engaging, under what circumstance, why, and how could it realistically be better compared to the current iteration?

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AverBeg7#1689 schrieb:

It is NOT valid to say "I feel like combat is not engaging, everyone just zooms". At what point did YOU feel like combat was not engaging, under what circumstance, why, and how could it be better compared to the current iteration?

who are you to say what is 'valid' here? this is feedback, and its clear as day what is the issue. You just refuse to knowledge the answers people are giving you.

Issue: zombie rush mobs that need to be dispatched within seconds or you are dead, aka zoom zoom playstyle.

people told you at what point this happens.

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AverBeg7#1689 schrieb:

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saashaa#5518 schrieb:

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AverBeg7#1689 schrieb:

what's breaking the game in the 3rd act?

in third act we have enough power to devastate campain and trivalize any mechanic - to use one button holding which have more dmg than synergies and so on.

Ok, but what specifically is doing this? It's just not my experience, I'm not familiar with builds that do that.

have you ever played through the campaign without using an OP cookie cutter?
mid act2 the game starts throwing hordes at you. This is why you get access to AoE prolif clear skills there. or you can brute force it with gear like you said.

And no, not every ARPG needs to devolve into one button screen explosions with thousands of mobs dying each second. Even Brevik was speaking on how this is a bad trend that has developed in ARPGs.

now whatever take you might have on ARPGS here is moot because GGG advertised this game as more than just remake of poe1 with emphasis on better and meaningful/impactful combat. This is what they sold, but they are trying to ship poe1 in a wrapper and that is making people a bit upset right now.

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AintCare#6513 schrieb:

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AverBeg7#1689 schrieb:

It is NOT valid to say "I feel like combat is not engaging, everyone just zooms". At what point did YOU feel like combat was not engaging, under what circumstance, why, and how could it be better compared to the current iteration?

who are you to say what is 'valid' here? this is feedback, and its clear as day what is the issue. You just refuse to knowledge the answers people are giving you.

It really isn't. Saying "everyone does x so I enjoy myself less, they shouldn't do x" isn't valid.

It is not something you actually experienced while playing. The frustration you experienced playing is a separate thing from what everyone is doing. The game has just about as much monsters in the campaign as it did in 0.1 (besides the extra abyss mobs). I do not see the actual problem you guys are talking about, in terms of the campaign. I need someone to tell me specifically what their problem was so I have some frame of reference for their ideal changes.

Now, can you tell me, specifically for you, while playing on your own character at what point did you feel like the game's progression broke? What skill and class were you using? What did it feel like? This is valuable feedback. Spitting at the wind is not helpful to anyone.

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AverBeg7#1689 schrieb:

Now, can you tell me, specifically for you, while playing on your own character at what point did you feel like the game's progression broke? What skill and class were you using? What did it feel like? This is valuable feedback. Spitting at the wind is not.

I already answered those questions. what is said is valid for all characters because this is how they deigned all of them. but

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AintCare#6513 schrieb:

You just refuse to knowledge the answers people are giving you.

take care m8