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PoE1 had it and has survived over a decade, gaining or at least maintaining player count at most new leagues. This is the evidence that enough people are okay with exp loss. Not in love with it necessarily, but understand it's purpose and at least are willing to engage with the game as is.
"Surviving" is not evidence that players love XP loss. You're pointing to the returning players, as if there isn't a consistent rapid dropoff soon after launch. Player dropoff is the opposite of willingness to engage with the game as is.
Darling, no matter how often you repeat it - the dropoff has NOTHING to do with the exp loss.
The drop happens because ppl "finished" the game. They achieved everything in the league they wanted to do and stopped playing.
Even if you look at databases like poe.ninja you will be proven wrong.
In the database are not all characters because you have to manually assign your character to appear there, so it's not the entire player base.
But still with not all ppl the numbers speak for themselves.
In Settlers, 80k listed characters made it to 95 or above and 30k made it to level 100 while level 100 isn't something most ppl go for because they play multiple characters and spend time levelling them and level 100 does not mark the end of the journey for most ppl or even more important, something they even care reaching.
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Steam represents a minority of their players yet steam player count is supposed to be a good metric for retention? Basic day one probability and statistics would tell you that's a load.
It's not everything, but it's not nothing.
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And let me point to every ARPG ever that didn't do xp loss that no longer exists or no longer gets updates...hmm?
Be my guest & don't forget to actually prove XP leniency is why they died.
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Darling, no matter how often you repeat it - the dropoff has NOTHING to do with the exp loss.
The drop happens because ppl "finished" the game. They achieved everything in the league they wanted to do and stopped playing.
This is called wishful thinking & being in denial... or is it something else? I'm pretty sure you've explicitly told (others who don't like XP loss) to stop playing, so why pretend it has NOTHING to do with dropoff? Are you lying to yourself, or did you think you could just get away with lying to me?
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Even if you look at databases like poe.ninja you will be proven wrong.
In the database are not all characters because you have to manually assign your character to appear there, so it's not the entire player base.
But still with not all ppl the numbers speak for themselves.
In Settlers, 80k listed characters made it to 95 or above and 30k made it to level 100 while level 100 isn't something most ppl go for because they play multiple characters and spend time levelling them and level 100 does not mark the end of the journey for most ppl or even more important, something they even care reaching.
Settlers league was at least 228,398 peak players to put your numbers in context & furthermore - many of those high levels are the same people making multiple characters. POE 1 has an even bigger player dropoff in the same time frame compared to 2 (@87% player dropoff). The numbers do speak for themselves, but they aren't saying what you're saying.
Zuletzt bearbeitet von SpankyKong#9805 um 12.02.2025, 09:38:32
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Steam represents a minority of their players yet steam player count is supposed to be a good metric for retention? Basic day one probability and statistics would tell you that's a load.
It's not everything, but it's not nothing.
"
And let me point to every ARPG ever that didn't do xp loss that no longer exists or no longer gets updates...hmm?
Be my guest & don't forget to actually prove XP leniency is why they died.
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Darling, no matter how often you repeat it - the dropoff has NOTHING to do with the exp loss.
The drop happens because ppl "finished" the game. They achieved everything in the league they wanted to do and stopped playing.
This is called wishful thinking & being in denial... or is it something else? I'm pretty sure you've explicitly told (others who don't like XP loss) to stop playing, so why pretend it has NOTHING to do with dropoff? Are you lying to yourself, or did you think you could just get away with lying to me?
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Even if you look at databases like poe.ninja you will be proven wrong.
In the database are not all characters because you have to manually assign your character to appear there, so it's not the entire player base.
But still with not all ppl the numbers speak for themselves.
In Settlers, 80k listed characters made it to 95 or above and 30k made it to level 100 while level 100 isn't something most ppl go for because they play multiple characters and spend time levelling them and level 100 does not mark the end of the journey for most ppl or even more important, something they even care reaching.
Settlers league was at least 228,398 peak players to put your numbers in context & furthermore - many of those high levels are the same people making multiple characters. POE 1 has an even bigger player dropoff in the same time frame compared to 2 (@87% player dropoff). The numbers do speak for themselves, but they aren't saying what you're saying.
Dude... you are new to PoE, you just look at numbers and things without understanding them, period.
That you don't know why the player dropoff happens is normal, but pretending that you do know - is cringe.
These ppl don't stop playing a league because of "buhu exp loss".
They stop playing because there is nothing to do for them anymore.
Some stop playing after they cleared/experienced everything the new league mechanic has to offer, some stop playing because they tested/played all builds they wanted to play, some stop playing because they farmed/traded multiple mirrors, some stop playing because they min/maxed their build until they were happy, some stop playing after they got 36 or 40 of the challenges, some stop playing because they have real-life things to do - there are sooo many reasons, but ppl don't stop playing because they cannot handle the exp loss.
That's nonsense ppl only come up with when they have not the slightest clue about the player base and how a league works.
So tell me, how can it be that the PoE1 community views "levelling" in general as to easy, but YOU think ppl stop playing because "exp loss"?!?
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[Double Post]
Zuletzt bearbeitet von JakkerONAIR#4902 um 12.02.2025, 09:51:53
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Dude... you are new to PoE, you just look at numbers and things without understanding them, period.
That you don't know why the player dropoff happens is normal, but pretending that you do know - is cringe.
These ppl don't stop playing a league because of "buhu exp loss".
They stop playing because there is nothing to do for them anymore.
Some stop playing after they cleared/experienced everything the new league mechanic has to offer, some stop playing because they tested/played all builds they wanted to play, some stop playing because they farmed/traded multiple mirrors, some stop playing because they min/maxed their build until they were happy, some stop playing after they got 36 or 40 of the challenges, some stop playing because they have real-life things to do - there are sooo many reasons, but ppl don't stop playing because they cannot handle the exp loss.
That's nonsense ppl only come up with when they have not the slightest clue about the player base and how a league works.
So tell me, how can it be that the PoE1 community views "levelling" in general as to easy, but YOU think ppl stop playing because "exp loss"?!?
What's nonsensical is the laughable facade that 80%-85% player drop off can't be improved & that things just have to be that way.
I pointed to Diablo 4 momth-to-month peak steam players to show it doesn't have to be that way.
New players more than doubled the player base in case you need to be reminded of your place; our feedback is just as valid as anyone, so fuck off with the constant condescension and patronizing as if new players are obligated to agree with you. We're paying customers too.
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What's nonsensical is the laughable facade that 80%-85% player drop off can't be improved & that things just have to be that way.
I pointed to Diablo 4 momth-to-month peak steam players to show it doesn't have to be that way.
New players more than doubled the player base in case you need to be reminded of your place; our feedback is just as valid as anyone, so fuck off with the constant condescension and patronizing as if new players are obligated to agree with you. We're paying customers too.
It's not a laughable facade. Obviously, you would have a few more players when removing a thing they dislike, but I already told you... removing something some ppl don't like does NOT equal "more players" because the removal of something YOU don't like can cause others to stop playing at all or drop off way earlier, so your argument is a nothing-burger.
And comparing the "Diablo 4" player base with the "Path of Exile" player base is nothing you should do because they are entirely different and approach their game for different reasons.
If you look at numbers outside of Steam you will see that the amount of new players is noticeable, but you are not even close to being a majority.
In July 2024 (PoE1 - Settlers League Release) had a max of 3,426,530 players playing at the same time over all platforms and went to 9,385,951 in August.
Sure, these numbers are better because the game is F2P and does not cost 30 bucks to even get in, but compare that now to December 2024 (PoE2 - EA Release), where we had 3,557,840 over all platforms.
We got many new players, but in total it's not close to being "double" or a majority.
Furthermore, it's not about "YOUR feedback is invalid or worth less", it's about "the things you say to backup your feedback are straight-out lies and misrepresenting information". THAT'S the issue I have with you, not that you want the exp loss to be removed.
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It's not a laughable facade. Obviously, you would have a few more players when removing a thing they dislike, but I already told you... removing something some ppl don't like does NOT equal "more players" because the removal of something YOU don't like can cause others to stop playing at all or drop off way earlier, so your argument is a nothing-burger.
And comparing the "Diablo 4" player base with the "Path of Exile" player base is nothing you should do because they are entirely different and approach their game for different reasons.
If you look at numbers outside of Steam you will see that the amount of new players is noticeable, but you are not even close to being a majority.
In July 2024 (PoE1 - Settlers League Release) had a max of 3,426,530 players playing at the same time over all platforms and went to 9,385,951 in August.
Sure, these numbers are better because the game is F2P and does not cost 30 bucks to even get in, but compare that now to December 2024 (PoE2 - EA Release), where we had 3,557,840 over all platforms.
We got many new players, but in total it's not close to being "double" or a majority.
Furthermore, it's not about "YOUR feedback is invalid or worth less", it's about "the things you say to backup your feedback are straight-out lies and misrepresenting information". THAT'S the issue I have with you, not that you want the exp loss to be removed.
"All data presented by ActivePlayer.io are all estimated data and should NOT be used as factual reference"
Don't ever talk to me about misrepresenting information.
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It's not a laughable facade. Obviously, you would have a few more players when removing a thing they dislike, but I already told you... removing something some ppl don't like does NOT equal "more players" because the removal of something YOU don't like can cause others to stop playing at all or drop off way earlier, so your argument is a nothing-burger.
And comparing the "Diablo 4" player base with the "Path of Exile" player base is nothing you should do because they are entirely different and approach their game for different reasons.
If you look at numbers outside of Steam you will see that the amount of new players is noticeable, but you are not even close to being a majority.
In July 2024 (PoE1 - Settlers League Release) had a max of 3,426,530 players playing at the same time over all platforms and went to 9,385,951 in August.
Sure, these numbers are better because the game is F2P and does not cost 30 bucks to even get in, but compare that now to December 2024 (PoE2 - EA Release), where we had 3,557,840 over all platforms.
We got many new players, but in total it's not close to being "double" or a majority.
Furthermore, it's not about "YOUR feedback is invalid or worth less", it's about "the things you say to backup your feedback are straight-out lies and misrepresenting information". THAT'S the issue I have with you, not that you want the exp loss to be removed.
"All data presented by ActivePlayer.io are all estimated data and should NOT be used as factual reference"
Don't ever talk to me about misrepresenting information.
Darling, I haven't said "These numbers are the factual truth", I am not you.
However, the estimated numbers are representative to a degree.
Could they be too high? Sure.
It's about putting things in relation. With these numbers, you get at least a good idea of how the population is.
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And let me point to every ARPG ever that didn't do xp loss that no longer exists or no longer gets updates...hmm?
Be my guest & don't forget to actually prove XP leniency is why they died.
Not how basic logic works. What I've done is create a proof of contradiction to your claim, not created a claim of my own.
To clarify, the original claim being that removing xp loss will save the game.
Zuletzt bearbeitet von Redthorne82#3177 um 12.02.2025, 11:09:16
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Not how basic logic works. What I've done is create a proof of contradiction to your claim, not created a claim of my own..
You didn't even give any actual specific examples. You've given proof of nothing.
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To clarify, the original claim being that removing xp loss will save the game.
To clarify, actually look up what this person quoted from me when they made that response. This is just lying.
Zuletzt bearbeitet von SpankyKong#9805 um 12.02.2025, 11:17:13
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